The civic crest of Aldridge and Brownhills UDC, granted in 1968 and with motto suggested by two Shire Oak School pupils. To find out more about it at the site it came from, lick on the image.
I had this enquiry in the week, which I think makes good research material for a wet, bank holiday weekend. The enquirer – known only as Glenys – poses some interesting questions. I’ve not heard of ‘The White House’ Walsall Wood, and can only think of Shire Oak House in Sandhills.
I’ve heard the story about the UDC records before, but suspect it’s hokum. What I do know is that the breakup was messy, and that the records that do exist are spread through archives far and wide – Walsall Local Hisotry Centre, Lichfield Records Office, Stafford etc. Gerald Reece recently told me records he was looking for were actually found at Newcastle, Tyne & Wear, rather than Necastle Under Lyme. They’d been sent to the wrong place by mistake.
Glenys asked the following:
Hello Bob,
I am doing research for friends in London. Particularly concerning Alfred Lloyd born 1886 in Clayhanger who was assistant surveyor for Brownhills council early 1900s, then moved to Hammersmith London in the 30s to be Borough surveyor. His father John lived at the White House, Walsall Wood.
John’s obituary in the Walsall Observer 1914 recorded that he was a member of Brownhills council around 1910. He died in 1914. It stated that he contributed to the poor of the area ‘quietly and unobtrusively’. Any leads would be fantastic as the now John did not know his father Alfred who died when he was only 2 years old.
Until I discovered John Snr had no idea of his grandfather or his benevolence.
Incidently, is it true that all Brownhills electoral records and council minutes for the period 1910-1930 were destroyed in a fire by council officials in a fit of pique at the almagamation of councils?! As this is what I have been led to believe.
Looking at your blog – and I’m afraid to say this is the first time I have used this media – I can see you are a really busy and interesting person so I will understand if you do not spend much time on this but anything would mean a lot to a 77yr old who wants to know his roots…
Kind regards
Glenys
So, what can we find of the Lloyd family, their connection with the Urban District Council and The White House, Walsall Wood? All contributions gratefully accepted. Comment here, or BrownhillsBob at Googlemail dot com. Cheers.
My best wishes to Glenys, and thanks for the kind words.
Brownhills High Street in the early 1900s, undoubtedly as Alfred Lloyd and his father would have remembered it. A wonderful picture from ‘Memories of Brownhills Past’ by Clarice Mayo and Geoff Harrington.
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HI Bob
the White House at Walsall Wood? Perhaps Dr Paterson’s house on Chester Road?
David
HI BOb
first trawl through ancestry
father John Lloyd, grocer in Clayhanger in 1891. He was born in Wolverhampton as was his wife Mary. They had 10 children, Alfred was second youngest, aged 4 in 1891, his younger brother Sidney was aged 2. I would think there were very few grocers shops in Clayhanger then..perhaps only one!
(children were Thomas, 21; Mary,20 years;Edward, 15; Catherine,12; Francis,11; Richard,10; Ernest, 9; June, 6; Alfred,4; Sidney, 2 years old… in 1891 The eldest son, Thomas aged 21 was born in Wolverhampton; the others were born in Clayhanger)
cheers
David
HI Bob
another trawl and a possible answer
1991 Alfred Lloyd and his wife lived in Lichfeld Road Walsall Wood ( the name HIgh Street was not yet used )..1911 census is a pain..but..fortunately Lloyd lived 6 doors away from Headley, grocers, with drapers and fuiterers as neighbours. Hence ..the HIgh Street, Walsall Wood !
Blog article “You could buy anything at all there” lists the shops in the late 1920s, 30s and mentions ” the White House”.
Lloyds dwelling had 6 rooms.and I think it is still there. Google Earth shows a shop “Ultimate Choice” in the HIgh Street… This or the one by it, may have been the one!
all the best, Glenys
David
HI Bob
1991..should read 1911 ( time for my sanatogen?)
David
HI Bob
Ziksby’s clearer list of the High Street shops has helped. Google Earth shows a flower shop nearby, “Entwined”. Lloyd lived in the house with the buckets of flowers outside. The White House would have been the butchers shop next door but one ! Got there in the end.
David
From the Probate Register, Alfred’s father: LLOYD John of the White House Lichfield-road Walsall Wood Staffordshire died 19 May 1914 Probate London 28 August to Richard Lloyd miner and John Lloyd engine driver.
Effects £4465 3s 6d. Resworn £4375 3s 6d.
Hi Andy
I have sent a clip to Bob from the Lichfield Mercury about the sale of the Estate in which the White House is mentioned. He can pass it on to those concerned.
All the best Pedro
Hi Bob
please .. if Glenys uses this cover page to link to Oakparkrunner’s blog..then goes to Walsall Wood Past and Present she will find some very good photos.
And,, on this blog, goes to local quiz 1 ( at the top of the cover page)..takes a comfy chair and a good cup of coffee.. I am sure some good information about Walsall Wood will be found !
David
John Lloyd (Alfred’s father). 1871 Clayhanger, a few records away from the Wheel Inn; coal miner. 1881 Beer House, Clayhanger between canal and Royal George Inn; coal miner and beer house keeper. 1891 Clayhanger; grocer; near Bullings Heath and canal, Alfred age 4. I suspect these were not all the same place. Ideas?
1901 Clayhanger Road, between May Villa and Newland Ter[race?], retired contractor buildings; Alfred, 15, Clerk – Local Board Office.
1911 White House, Lichfield Road, Walsall Wood, private means – son Sydney Herbert builder.
1911 Alfred at Lichfield Road, Walsall Wood, Assistant Surveyor, Brownhills UDC.
I suspect Glenys has done this already (if not I can give more details), but for local interest, perhaps we can locate the earlier residences?
J Lloyd is mentioned on many occasions in the list for reports under Brownhills Urban Council.
He was vice chair on at least two occasions from 1899. Not much mention of what he did, at first sight, yet a bit on Occupation Road. I believe someone has mentioned the road on the blog?
More info later, Pedro
Hi Bob,
Very interested in the White House discussion. This building was next to Headley’s in the old photos and was quite distinguished for its time, chimneys and windows, a quite roomy house, and very suitable for occupancy by a public figure as a private residence. In the old O.D. for 1901, the house is listed as a Private Residence, Lloyd, John. White house, along with the vicar, and other village notables. in other pictures, after becoming a shop the “White House” title, by which it was known by villagers was embodied in a sign above the shop doors. and was always known as “THe White House”. I have a suspicion, nothing more, that later, it could have been the first Co-op store in Walsall Wood. Old pictures show a store with two entrances and this was big enough to accommodate this, before the purpose- built store on the other was erected. After that it was unused for some time, in the 30’s until Audrey Archer opened a flower shop there in the 1940’s. After that a cousin of Audrey’s opened it as a radio shop.in the 1950’s
I would advise Glenys to buy an old 1901 O.D..for for visual proof of John LLloyd’s identity and habitation in 1901.
Regards,
HI Bob
this shop was known as a drapers shop by my old friend. in the .1920s.then it stood empty for a while. On Google Earth it shows now as the Mermaid Fish Bar ..and one half of the building is still white! Headleys shop was the small
single storey bulding.now a sandwich bar..It was also a Midland Bank at one time
cheers , and a big thanks to David Oakley for the info.
David
Hello all you wonderful people! So much info and knowledge pouring out…
I cannot thank you enough for the interest shown.
Now, David I know you may think I’m a bit ‘thick’ but what is the O.D.?
Annie and John are desperate to find where ALFRED was living between 1911 and 1930’s when he moved to London; and why.
Have the electoral registers for this period survived and if so where are they?!
Kind regards to all, Glenys
Hi Glenys
Electoral registers? I’ve never tried, but British Library may be able to help you;-www.bl.uk/socialservices………..their main building is 96 Euston Road..but if you can link via the web or phone first you may save a few years’ work..Your local libray may point you in the right direction, too. Good luck
O.D.? we must wait for David Oakley ,Pedro or Andy to give the answer, I think.
David
hello bloggers. don’t leave me ‘hanging!
Have a couple more queries… Does anyone know of (uncle) Sydney and Lilian Lloyd who ran the post office Walsall Wood in 1950. Followed by their son Denis Gorden and wife Patricia (Price).
Also, OUR John Lloyd’s auntie Catherine’s husband who died Jan 1935. Where was Littleton Colliery, Teddesley Hay? His death was reported as “accidently killed by a quantity of coal suddenly falling and knocking out a tree which struck deceased on the back of neck”. I know of Teddesley Street the Butts. Is this it?
The present John Lloyd,and his wife Annnie are visiting Walsall, for the first time soon. So as much information as possible will add to their itinery of places to visit to piece together some of John’s unknown past…
Much appreciation to all of you, Glenys x
Have only just stumbled across this so am probably way too late but I knew Pat and Den Lloyd well. Unfortunately Pat died in 2012 and Den many years before. I can tell you more if this thread is still live.
Hy Isobel
Like the Dartford Tunnel, we rarely close. If you have anything to add, please do. Many posts come back to life years after posting as new information is added in the comments!
Thanks, and you’re most welcome, would love to hear what you have to say
Thanks
Bob
It’s a way off our patch, but Littleton Colliery was north of Cannock at Huntingdon, beside the A34 Stafford Road.
Teddesley Hay is a rural civil parish a bit further north on the west of the A34 and north of B5012. Much is occupied by Teddesley Park centred on Teddesley Home Farm. The hall is long since demolished. For some history see http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=53410. I think there is no general public access to the estate, but a public footpath crosses more or less north-south.
I guess Teddesley Street is named in some sort of connection; wealthy landowner / businessman, perhaps. The Butts area was associated with limestone mining. Could have been developed by Littleton?
Hi Glenys
I am told that Mrs Dale ran the Post Office in 1950s in HIgh Street Walsall Wood. (( David Oakley meant 1901 OS (not OD ) map..Ordnance Survey, ))
David
Thanks for that David E. We now think it maybe Brownhills Post Office as Syd and Liilan were living on that High Street in 1938, also son Denis who married Patricia Price ( it seems THEY may have taken over the running of said Post Office )… Any thoughts?
The present Lloyd’s are on their way to Walsall/Brownhills next weekend to visit sites where John’s ancestors lived and worked. Any information regarding the past Lloyds would be gratefully received! Thanks ( oh the OS – cheers)
Hi Glenys,
I found your post the other day when I was researching my husband’s family tree.
I believe that my husband is the Great Great grandson of the original John Lloyd from Clayhangar.
If you want to get i touch with me, we can share information.
Kind regards,
Alison Bishop
Might be worth noting that Brownhills Post Office was not where it is now. The one I remember, presumably goes back to 1930s, was at the corner of High Street and Church Road, now partly an estate agent.
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Not sure if this post is still current. I think my husband is the Great Great Grandson on John Lloyd. I would love to know if I am correct. I believe that John Lloyds daughter Mary Ann married Frederick Henry James Smith, their daughter Gladys Marjorie Smith married Ernest Edward Palmer, their daughter Margaret Marion Palmer married Arthur Bishop, my husband David Bishop is their son. Arthur Bishop still lives in Brownhills. Please get in touch to tell me if I am correct.